HN Distilled

Essential insights from Hacker News discussions

Samsung embeds IronSource spyware app on phones across WANA

Original Article

Hacker News Discussion

Here's a breakdown of the key themes from the Hacker News discussion, supported by direct quotes from the commenters:

Concerns Over Bloatware and Privacy on Android Devices, Especially Samsung

A major theme is the concern and frustration over pre-installed bloatware and potential privacy violations on Android phones, particularly Samsung's lower-end models.

  • "AppCloud—pre-installed on Samsung’s A and M series smartphones...Samsung’s A and M series smartphones are their cheapest models so their buyers probably cannot afford better phones." - boramalper highlights the economic aspect, suggesting the problem disproportionately affects those who can't afford premium devices.
  • "I can confirm that AppCloud is installed on certain carrier versions of S series phone as well." - rs186 reveals the issue extends beyond budget models.
  • "All Android phone but pixel ones have bloatware preinstalled. Some are worst, like Xiaomi...If you don’t want bloatware (spyware), it’s either pixel or iPhone." - aucisson_masque bluntly states the perceived lack of options besides Pixel or iPhone for users prioritizing privacy.
  • "given that Samsung is quietly doing these shady things with my phone, and other annoyances like Samsung forcing Galaxy AI on me (try selecting some texts in a browser or webview) which cannot be uninstalled and the terrible Samsung Pay interface, I am questioning my device choice every day." - rs186 expresses disillusionment with Samsung due to these intrusive features.
  • "Buying a device that only runs OEN Android is ridiculous for this exact reason." - sneak

Calls for Decoupling Hardware and Software in the Android Ecosystem

Many participants yearn for a system where users can choose their software independently of their hardware, similar to the PC market.

  • "We need to decouple phone hardware from phone software, as we did with computers." - sneak states the fundamental desire for more user control.
  • "We do, but I don't see it happening anytime soon. Many banking / government apps and even some games use the Play Integrity API, which AFAIK is starting to require remote attestation for newer devices." - bilkow acknowledges this desire but points to the practical obstacles presented by security requirements and DRM.

Alternative Phone Recommendations and Strategies

The discussion explored several alternative phone options or strategies for those concerned about privacy and bloatware.

  • "You're better off getting a preowned Pixel to flash with a secure ROM in this scenario." - bigyabai advocates for using a Pixel with a custom ROM for increased security and control.
  • "Motorola has well priced excellent phones with minimal bloat." - j-bos promotes Motorola as a less bloated alternative.
  • "Zenphone is a bliss." - sabellito recommends Zenphone.
  • "OnePlus has a phenomenal software experience" - Danjoe4

Debate over the Effectiveness and Cost of Switching to iPhone

Switching to Apple's iPhone is suggested as a solution, but debated due to cost and potential vendor lock-in issues.

  • "Personally, if I found this on my device it'd be the final straw to grit my teeth and finally get a personal apple device." - AlotOfReading expresses a willingness to switch to iPhone due to frustration with Android bloatware.
  • "Getting an iPhone won't help if you if later down the line Apple decides to push an OTA update that forces the same functionality." - bigyabai cautions against relying too heavily on Apple, highlighting potential for similar issues in the future and vendor lock-in.
  • "Just buy a 5 year old iPhone - it's likely to be still better than the cheapo phone, and will get longer support as well, while being sold at rock bottom prices…The 16 is barely better and I was suprised to find just how little the old one was worth second hand, considering it still runs circles around most midrange Android handsets." - torginus suggests older iPhones as a cost-effective and reliable alternative.
  • "A refurbished iPhone 13 is $300 on amazon, which is close to the cheapest M ($250)" - hedora compares prices.

Skepticism and Counterarguments

Some participants expressed skepticism towards the original article's claims or offered counterarguments.

  • "hmm have you actually read the article? did you find anything of "substance" other than hand-wavy "this company is from israel, so must be mosad" or "has notorious for its questionable practices" (without even giving actual examples or incidents)?" - more-nitor questions the factual basis of the original article, suggesting potential bias.
  • "The trick is to define "bloatware". Is that known knowns (stuff that's visible), known unknowns (stuff that's added that's not visible), and/or unknown unknowns (stuff added we are pretty sure is there but can't prove)?" - burnt-resistor raises a valid point, highlighting the difficulty in defining and detecting "bloatware."

Exploring the Fairphone Option

Fairphone is presented as an ethical and customizable Android alternative.

  • "No need to ditch Android. Fairphone exists...Their stock android is fine. If you want more privacy, installing e/OS/ is trivial. It blows my mind that anyone is concluding Samsung stuff is worth buying under any circumstances." - hkt strongly advocates for Fairphone as a solution.
  • "What about people who are not in Europe? And for US carriers, you are basically locked out of Wi-Fi calling if you are not using one of the whitelisted devices." rs186 points out the limitations of some alternatives like fairphone.

Regional Differences in Phone Availability and Pricing

Commenters point out the geographical constraints on pricing, phone models and availability. * "Is this Amazon US? Because even in Ireland, iPhone 16 costs 41% higher than in the US (979 EUR = 1,128 USD in Ireland vs 799 USD in the US)." - boramalper * Not in the US. - mellow-lake-day