Here's a summary of the key themes from the Hacker News discussion, with supporting quotes:
Skepticism Regarding WhatsApp's Ad Implementation and Timing
Several users expressed surprise and cynicism about WhatsApp's delayed integration of ads, suggesting potential mismanagement and past failures.
- snapcaster: "Surprised it took them this long"
- 1oooqooq: "they got so lucky with whatsbook taking over entire countries, they were swimming in money just selling support channels to gov and big companies...literal chat dialog tree with 4 options that is not connected to anything for around 250k/year."
- toast0: "They were working on it in 2019 when I left, I thought it was tested in one country after that and then it got shelved. IIRC, it needed a ToS change and there was too much pushback."
- blitzar: "> things that needed to be done to make ads doable and not terrible ... none of my ideas were deemed feasible at the time. Don't sell yourself short ... they did all the things to make ads doable it was just not feasible to make them not terrible."
- toast0: In my mind, early focus on ToS could have possibly gotten the change more palletable/directed the project towards more palletable choices or perhaps more likely gotten to the cancellation decision faster and people could work on different things.
The Enduring Power (and Limitations) of Network Effects
The discussion frequently touched upon the "network effect" as a major barrier to switching from WhatsApp, while also acknowledging that these effects are not insurmountable. Some users pointed out that past platform shifts have occurred despite strong network effects.
- laurent123456: "As always network effect will be the problem. I know plenty of people on WhatsApp and almost nobody on Signal"
- tiluha: "This does not match my experience in Germany. If somebody gives you their phone number it is just expected that you can reach them on WhatsApp and i have yet to meet anyone that doesn't use WhatsApp."
- AlexandrB: "It's a problem but not insurmountable. Otherwise we'd all still be using ICQ/AIM/MSN Messenger/Skype/etc."
- blitzar: "We are off those because of multi messanger platforms made switching to the 'hot new thing' very low friction. It was only once mobile came along that the playing field narrowed so much. Current networks have way more lock in than back in the day."
- paxys: "Network effects aren't a big deal when it comes to messaging. There was a time when people thought iPhone wouldn't be able to overcome Blackberry because everyone was on BBM. In the last couple decades we've seen people go from ICQ to AIM/Yahoo/MSN to Google Talk to Skype to Facebook Messenger to BBM to Whatsapp/iMessage/Instagram, with dozens of smaller options like Kik, Viber, Line, Signal, Telegram all hanging around. It doesn't take much to cause another shift in the space."
- randerson: "It's easy to have multiple chat apps in parallel though, each with their own network...Ads will make more people Signal-curious, or even drive people back to text messages...Think of Skype, which at one point everyone I knew was on. That network didn't protect them from being replaced by competitors."
- leokennis: "At least in The Netherlands, WhatsApp could show a 60 second unskippable modal ad video on every launch, and still get away with it due to network effects. If you’re not on WhatsApp, no updates or news from your kids school, your sports team, your family, your car dealership etc. for you."
Frustrations with Signal's Usability and Backup Features for Non-Technical Users
Several users highlighted Signal's limitations, especially for less tech-savvy individuals, focusing on media management, back up issues, and a perceived lack of user-friendliness.
- jahnu: "Signal have a few things that make it a hard sell...It's really hard to clean up media...So the size of it just grows and grows and grows until it's using all the space on your phone. Not a good fit for non-technical types...Secondly, no web view. There is the desktop app yes, which is flaky, slow and wants to update every day or two...I just can't see average people putting up with those inconveniences and that's just a couple of them."
- AlecSchueler: "> So the size of it just grows and grows and grows until it's using all the space on your phone. Not a good fit for non-technical types. To be fair I've met plenty of non-techie types whose phones were 'full' of stuff from WhatsApp or photos that had already been backed up, because the idea they could clear their local storage would never cross their minds. I've seen people buy new phones instead of clearing their cache."
- jahnu: "Yes it's also a problem there but WhatsApp gives you the tools to fix the problem in minutes if not seconds, or ask your tech literate relative or friend to help and it only takes them the couple of minutes to clear it and maybe show you how. With Signal it can take hours of work so what happens is the non-techy person understands 'oh this app filled my phone up I shouldn't use it'."
- MrDOS: "I stopped recommending Signal to nontechnical folks due to the inability to back up messages on iOS. People are pretty protective of their message history, and having everything tied to a single device with no recourse for backups is a nonstarter...She was devastated, and refuses to touch it now."
- jahnu: "Oh yes this too. How could I forget!"
- andrepd: "It's very frustrating, I admit. Backups and archival are indeed a pet peeve of mine, as are the frequent redesigns (but that's just a 'feature' virtually every single god-damn modern app)...What is the alternative though? A private chat app, mobile + desktop, syncing, with enough ease of setup and use for normies to adopt? I don't see it."
- jahnu: "I suppose the true alternative would be a standard open protocol that enables this cross platform."
- nsagent: "I used to use Signal exclusively rather than Whatsapp, but I've had lots of issues sending media. This has not been a problem with Whatsapp, so I've recently begun to use Whatsapp more. There are also issues with message history that I've encountered on Signal that don't exist on Whatsapp...If Signal could address these concerns I'd be happy to move away from Whatsapp."
Potential for a Shift Away from WhatsApp Due to Privacy Concerns
Despite network effects and usability issues, some participants indicated increasing privacy concerns may drive users to alternatives like Signal. A shift in public perception regarding Meta's trustworthiness might accelerate this trend.
- randerson: "People are also increasingly worried about retaliation from the government for their supposedly free speech, which has already driven a few people I know to secure alternatives that aren't operated by Trump allies."
- AlecSchueler: "But since January the trust in Meta has not only plummeted but it's become a mainstream enough talking point that I now receive invites to join Signal groups from--for want of a better term--normal people. Two of the local parenting groups I'm on are on Signal and no one ever mentions it or questions it, it's just 'here's the group link' and the expectation that everyone has it installed."
- add-sub-mul-div: Discerning people will already seek out other options on their own, the vast majority won't. We know the pattern from the respective Reddit and Twitter enshittification phases.
- bondarchuk: If I can only message with discerning people might as well not have any messaging app at all.