Redemption and Opportunity in the Prison System
Several commenters express positive sentiments regarding the opportunity for rehabilitation and productive contribution within the prison system, highlighting the author's personal journey and the broader potential for such programs.
- "I'm glad to hear accounts of people in the prison system who are given the opportunity to do some good... the fact that the author recognises that they were in a bad situation and have been able to make positive progress since being given the opportunity to is really nice to hear" - voidUpdate
- "That is pretty awesome! I can imagine there are so many others that would benefit from programs like the one you are a part of, congratulations!" - JonKKelly
- "Coming to prison, specifically in Maine, was the best thing that ever happened to me." - dvektor
Perspectives on Drug-Related Offenses and Personal Responsibility
The discussion touches upon the complexities of drug-related offenses, distinguishing between personal use, dealing, and the role of the individual in their circumstances. There are varying degrees of sympathy expressed, tempered by considerations of personal responsibility and the potential harm caused to others.
- voidUpdate states "In my opinion, if you are using drugs personally, I don't really see a problem. If you commit some crime while under the influence which could harm another person, eg driving while drugged, obviously that's a different story... If you're selling to other people, that feels a bit more iffy to me because you're affecting other people with that... though I do realise that preventing the sale is effectively the same as preventing the usage..."
- int_19h argues the "nature of the drug also matters IMO. I don't have a problem with people selling stuff like cannabis or LSD to consenting able-minded adults, but given the nature of opioids, there's no responsible way to consume them outside of medical necessity."
- BryantD quotes the author's prior post to highlight the author's past involvement as a dealer "So instead of coming back home broke and apologetic, I ended up pretty deep into this and soon was making tens of thousands of dollars a week, very much unapologetically.", and then further quotes his rationale: "I was left with the difficult choice of either living there and walking to a temp agency with hopes of making $10.50/hour doing manual labor (without an ID or social security card at this point), or getting on a bus to NYC to see some associates, and coming back in a week or so with $15-25k in my pocket and living in comfy luxury hotels until I could rent an apartment... I chose the latter".
Concerns about Exploitation of Prison Labor
A significant portion of the conversation revolves around the ethics of prison labor, particularly concerning fair compensation and potential exploitation, referencing the 13th Amendment.
- chatmasta asks, "How does the compensation work? The US prison system has a bit of a nasty reputation when it comes to exploiting prison labor, so I hope those practices aren’t carrying over into these more forward-looking types of initiative..."
- laufey counters, "why would you expect him to be paid less? ...if he's working the same hours and is just as productive as any other employee, shouldn't he be paid the same?"
- the__alchemist suggests, "Supply and demand. He doesn't have many options, so doesn't have leverage in negotiating."
- wffurr points out that "The 13th amendment specifically allows slavery of prisoners."
- tristan957 argues, "If we pay people 40 cents an hour just to say they aren't slaves, they they are slaves for all intents and purposes."
- freedomben clarifies, "I don't disagree that 40 cents an hour is ludicrous and is only one notch above slavery, but I do think it worth pointing out that the work for 40 cents per hour is voluntary (i.e. they can quit or choose not to accept the work), whereas 'slavery' is very much not."
- larkost retorts that "In many cases the work is not really voluntary, there are sanctions for not taking it. Prisoners in some states are regularly put into solitary confinement for not 'volunteering' to work these jobs (a punishment that some areas deem torture). With that amount of coercion I can't see them as voluntary, and so the slavery label is awfully close to the mark."
Addressing Concerns: Transparency from Turso CEO
The CEO of Turso, glommer, directly engages in the discussion to address concerns about compensation and working conditions, asserting fair treatment and dispelling any notions of exploitation.
- glommer states, "We are free to negotiate any salary we want with him, the prison system doesn't put any caps, up or down. We are paying him well, and certainly not trying to enslave him or anything. There are some restrictions on how the payments are made but not the amount."
- glommer adds "We also don't pay him healthcare, because he wouldn't be able to use it."
Cost of Living and Fair Compensation
The discussion delves into the complexities of determining fair compensation, considering factors like cost of living and the unique circumstances of incarcerated individuals.
- TheGrumpyBrit equates this situation to "employers paying different rates depending on the country the employee is based in...a person incarcerated in New York City doesn't have the same living costs as a person who has to live in New York City, so you could reasonably argue that any 'Cost of living premium' that a company offers to NYC based employees doesn't need to apply to a person who doesn't experience those higher costs."
- koakuma-chan counters that "electronics cost the same in all countries," but dylan604 refutes this by explaining "With various forms of VAT and tariffs, things definitely do not cost the same in all countries."
- koakuma-chan concedes "The point is that they are definitely not cheaper than in the US" relevant to the situation being discussed.
- koakuma-chan speculates "I assume he doesn't have to pay rent while in prison and gets free meals, so unless they take some of his income, he might actually be doing pretty good."